XU4 heatsink without cooler (or low noise)

Moderators: mdrjr, odroid

XU4 heatsink without cooler (or low noise)

Unread postby mbonamusa » Wed Jul 29, 2015 12:14 am

Hello,

I want to use XU4 without cooler. I've seen if I remove cooler from XU4 heatsink, there is a hole, so this heatsink is not a good solution. Is there any heatsink from other boards (C1, U3) compatible with XU4 board? Or do you offer the possibility of buying a passive heatsink for XU4 in your store?
mbonamusa
 
Posts: 175
Joined: Mon Feb 25, 2013 9:08 pm
languages_spoken: catalan, spanish, english
ODROIDs: ODROID-X2, U2, U3

Re: XU4 heatsink without cooler

Unread postby lotar1958 » Wed Jul 29, 2015 6:44 am

I have been playing around with the XU4 Fan cooler and I noticed that the best solution to keep the CPU at low temperatures is to add a passive heatsink at the bottom of it.

To understand what I am trying to say is this... Run Boinc and as soon as the CPU temperature reaches 95-98 C
touch the Fan Cooler... You will notice that the Heatsink Fan is barely warm but if you touch the botton of the CPU on the other side... You may get burn!

My idea is to remove the Fan Cooler and put two passive HeatSinks. One HeatSink on the top of the CPU and at the buttom of CPU, put some thermal pads to level up the surface around and put a big passive HeatSink possibly made of copper.

Of course, if you have a better solution, and or you have some info about passive Heatsinks compatible with the XU4, I am all hears :)
lotar1958
 
Posts: 28
Joined: Sat Jul 18, 2015 2:53 pm
languages_spoken: english
ODROIDs: XU4

Re: XU4 heatsink without cooler (or low noise)

Unread postby odroid » Wed Jul 29, 2015 11:35 am

Our C1 heatsink is compatible with the XU4. Do not place the TIM because the surface of XU4 PCB is more flat and even than C1.
http://www.hardkernel.com/main/products ... 1637555371

But you will meet the thermal throttling frequently.
Change the governor to "Interactive" or "OnDemand" to make XU4 generate lower heat.

Also refer below links for further information about the DIY cooling stuff.
viewtopic.php?f=97&t=12477
viewtopic.php?f=93&t=11080
viewtopic.php?f=93&t=7125
viewtopic.php?f=65&t=1905
viewtopic.php?f=93&t=9306

viewtopic.php?f=65&t=15310
User avatar
odroid
Site Admin
 
Posts: 28610
Joined: Fri Feb 22, 2013 11:14 pm
languages_spoken: English
ODROIDs: ODROID

Re: XU4 heatsink without cooler

Unread postby luxmile » Wed Jul 29, 2015 12:42 pm

Hi,
Is there any space between Xu4 board and bottom case?
if any probably we can place some simple copper heatsinks on bottom case near the board just to reduce the heat,
also place a thermal pad to prevent any electric short...
luxmile
 
Posts: 33
Joined: Wed Feb 25, 2015 10:52 am
languages_spoken: english

Re: XU4 heatsink without cooler

Unread postby lotar1958 » Wed Jul 29, 2015 12:51 pm

Hello luxmile,
No, there is no space between the Xu4 board and the bottom case :(
The only way to add a HeatSink is to use these kind of Spacers and Standoffs
https://www.google.com/search?q=diced+screw&biw=1280&bih=893&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0CAcQ_AUoAmoVChMI3uTJpLf_xgIVSlc-Ch2XZQRM#tbm=isch&q=spacers+for+screws&imgrc=l95FnmMaSMz4lM%3A

Please keep me posted if you find something.
lotar1958
 
Posts: 28
Joined: Sat Jul 18, 2015 2:53 pm
languages_spoken: english
ODROIDs: XU4

Re: XU4 heatsink without cooler

Unread postby lotar1958 » Wed Jul 29, 2015 12:54 pm

odroid wrote:C1 heatsink is compatible with the XU4. Do not place the TIM because the surface of PCB is flat and even.
http://www.hardkernel.com/main/products ... 1637555371


Hello odroid,
I would place some thermal pads in the other side of the PCB under the CPU because there are some electronic components.
By the way, do you have any suggestion for a good thermal pad?
lotar1958
 
Posts: 28
Joined: Sat Jul 18, 2015 2:53 pm
languages_spoken: english
ODROIDs: XU4

Re: XU4 heatsink without cooler

Unread postby odroid » Wed Jul 29, 2015 1:20 pm

I have no idea about the thermal pad. :?:
User avatar
odroid
Site Admin
 
Posts: 28610
Joined: Fri Feb 22, 2013 11:14 pm
languages_spoken: English
ODROIDs: ODROID

Re: XU4 heatsink without cooler

Unread postby mbonamusa » Fri Jul 31, 2015 6:09 am

Once I'll have XU4 board I'll try it with the C1 heatsink (without TIM) and ondemand mode. I'll tell you
mbonamusa
 
Posts: 175
Joined: Mon Feb 25, 2013 9:08 pm
languages_spoken: catalan, spanish, english
ODROIDs: ODROID-X2, U2, U3

Re: XU4 heatsink without cooler

Unread postby odroid » Sat Aug 01, 2015 2:41 pm

Another valuable low-noise idea for the XU4.
viewtopic.php?f=65&t=15310
User avatar
odroid
Site Admin
 
Posts: 28610
Joined: Fri Feb 22, 2013 11:14 pm
languages_spoken: English
ODROIDs: ODROID

Re: XU4 heatsink without cooler

Unread postby fse » Wed Aug 05, 2015 3:58 pm

lotar1958 wrote:To understand what I am trying to say is this... Run Boinc and as soon as the CPU temperature reaches 95-98 C
touch the Fan Cooler... You will notice that the Heatsink Fan is barely warm but if you touch the botton of the CPU on the other side... You may get burn!


I have tried a number of active/passive heatsinks on the XU4 and I cannot get it to run 4 instances of burnCortexA8 without crash. (Possibly a PSU problem.) The temps. go up to ~98C and the system halts, it also does this when playing 1080p youtube videos in chromium. The IDLE at 20C ambient is <37C so interface and thermal compound seem to work well, still the high C at load ...

Has anyone got an idea how large a passive sink must be to support this? :)
Last edited by fse on Thu Aug 06, 2015 6:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
fse
 
Posts: 42
Joined: Tue Feb 03, 2015 8:40 pm
languages_spoken: english
ODROIDs: XU4, C1

Re: XU4 heatsink without cooler

Unread postby mbonamusa » Wed Aug 05, 2015 10:06 pm

odroid wrote:Our C1 heatsink is compatible with the XU4. Do not place the TIM because the surface of XU4 PCB is more flat and even than C1.
http://www.hardkernel.com/main/products ... 1637555371



I've seen you are redesigning C1 Board and website says than old C1 heatsink will not be compatible with new c1 board, so I guess the new C1 heatsink will not be compatible with XU4 board, isn't it? In this case, do you plan to have a passive heatsink compatible with XU4 board?
mbonamusa
 
Posts: 175
Joined: Mon Feb 25, 2013 9:08 pm
languages_spoken: catalan, spanish, english
ODROIDs: ODROID-X2, U2, U3

Re: XU4 heatsink without cooler

Unread postby odroid » Thu Aug 06, 2015 4:17 am

We will keep selling the original C1 heatsink.
User avatar
odroid
Site Admin
 
Posts: 28610
Joined: Fri Feb 22, 2013 11:14 pm
languages_spoken: English
ODROIDs: ODROID

Re: XU4 heatsink without cooler

Unread postby rikc » Mon Aug 17, 2015 10:56 pm

I just got the XU4 and almost immediately went looking for another cooling solution because the fan constantly starting and stopping and spinning loudly is a sure way to get myself quite annoyed. I read in this topic how an XU3 Lite owner put a passive (AMD) Northbridge cooler on his board: viewtopic.php?f=93&t=11080

Off-course the problem there is that this sink doesn't fit the case (just like the stock heatsink or C1 heatsink with the noctua fan). So I searched a bit for a 40 x 40 mm heatsink with a height as close to 15mm (room in the case) as possible. The website of Farnell/Elements4U/Newark provide me with the nice heatsink below with 13mm height and a dense array of cooling fins which should suit passive cooling I estimate. It was also available on Ebay. Especially since this heatsink is listed with a low thermal resistance (3.9 K/W).

Curious how it performs when I get it!
http://www.newark.com/malico/mbh40001-1 ... dp/53M8257
rikc
 
Posts: 9
Joined: Mon Aug 17, 2015 10:43 pm
languages_spoken: english, dutch, german, french
ODROIDs: XU4

Re: XU4 heatsink without cooler

Unread postby mikronauts » Tue Aug 18, 2015 2:56 am

Thanks for posting.

I could not find it on Ebay, but next time I order from newark I'll get one to play with.
http://Mikronauts.com ... Home of RoboPi, Pi Rtc Dio, Pi Jumper, EZasPi
mikronauts
 
Posts: 225
Joined: Wed Aug 27, 2014 4:28 am
Location: Langley, BC, Canada
languages_spoken: english
ODROIDs: odroid-w, odroid c1

Re: XU4 heatsink without cooler

Unread postby tebruno99 » Tue Aug 18, 2015 4:31 am

I have modded my odroid with a large northbridge heatsink and quieter fan. The thing is completely silent now and very cool. Results posted in this thread:
viewtopic.php?f=93&t=11080
tebruno99
 
Posts: 16
Joined: Fri Jul 24, 2015 3:13 pm
languages_spoken: english
ODROIDs: ODROID-XU4

Re: XU4 heatsink without cooler

Unread postby mikronauts » Tue Aug 18, 2015 4:34 am

Looks good! I'll have to see if I can find that Noctua.
http://Mikronauts.com ... Home of RoboPi, Pi Rtc Dio, Pi Jumper, EZasPi
mikronauts
 
Posts: 225
Joined: Wed Aug 27, 2014 4:28 am
Location: Langley, BC, Canada
languages_spoken: english
ODROIDs: odroid-w, odroid c1

Re: XU4 heatsink without cooler

Unread postby rikc » Wed Aug 26, 2015 3:43 am

rikc
 
Posts: 9
Joined: Mon Aug 17, 2015 10:43 pm
languages_spoken: english, dutch, german, french
ODROIDs: XU4

Re: XU4 heatsink without cooler

Unread postby rikc » Wed Aug 26, 2015 6:20 am

A question:

With the stock fan (still waiting for my replacement heatsink) the typical temperatures while idling with an empty desktop (~10% utilization of two of the main cores) and ambient room temperature are:
odroid@odroid:~$ sudo cat /sys/devices/10060000.tmu/temp
sensor0 : 56000
sensor1 : 52000
sensor2 : 56000
sensor3 : 57000
sensor4 : 52000


Running a (stuttering) 1080p video on Youtube in Chromium (all main cores over ~80% utilization) gives me:
odroid@odroid:~$ sudo cat /sys/devices/10060000.tmu/temp
sensor0 : 91000
sensor1 : 83000
sensor2 : 94000
sensor3 : 95000
sensor4 : 77000


Are these normal temperatures, to be expected? Or might this indicate a poor heatsink contact? The fan does spin a lot.
rikc
 
Posts: 9
Joined: Mon Aug 17, 2015 10:43 pm
languages_spoken: english, dutch, german, french
ODROIDs: XU4

Re: XU4 heatsink without cooler

Unread postby odroid » Wed Aug 26, 2015 1:40 pm

The temperature is normal.
User avatar
odroid
Site Admin
 
Posts: 28610
Joined: Fri Feb 22, 2013 11:14 pm
languages_spoken: English
ODROIDs: ODROID

Re: XU4 heatsink without cooler

Unread postby rikc » Wed Aug 26, 2015 3:26 pm

Ok, thx for the feedback!
rikc
 
Posts: 9
Joined: Mon Aug 17, 2015 10:43 pm
languages_spoken: english, dutch, german, french
ODROIDs: XU4

Re: XU4 heatsink without cooler

Unread postby rikc » Thu Sep 03, 2015 5:10 pm

Ok, after some searching I found this cooler!

http://www.ebay.nl/itm/Aluminum-Heatsin ... 1518718878?

Ordered it, will have to cut a little material from the sides since it's 45x45mm but otherwise it's got the same mounting as the stock cooler.
rikc
 
Posts: 9
Joined: Mon Aug 17, 2015 10:43 pm
languages_spoken: english, dutch, german, french
ODROIDs: XU4

Re: XU4 heatsink without cooler

Unread postby Chris098 » Sun Sep 13, 2015 4:48 am

Has the heatsink arrived?
I wonder how it fits. I'd like to order one for my XU4 too.
Chris098
 
Posts: 2
Joined: Wed Jul 29, 2015 7:47 am
languages_spoken: english
ODROIDs: U3, soon XU4

Re: XU4 heatsink without cooler (or low noise)

Unread postby Raymond Day » Fri Oct 02, 2015 1:22 am

I got this heatsink just yesterday took a wile like 4 weeks I guess.

Put it on my Odroid-XU4 today. Took the heatsink off it and the thermal interface material that came with the Odroid-XU4 heatsink and used the fan from it too. I had to put the fan up-side-down so it would fit on the new taller heatsink.

It seems to be working good. I have not herd the fan run in about 2 hours.

Wanted to make a script to see if the fan turns on. Here is what I did for it.

wget https://raw.githubusercontent.com/f1vef ... controller

chmod it with 777 and renamed it with a .sh at the end.

Code: Select all
#!/bin/bash

while true;
do
       echo `date` >> /var/log/odroid-fan-controller.txt
       "/root/odroid-fan-controller.sh status" >> /var/log/odroid-fan-controller.txt
       sleep 60
done


But something is wrong with it. I got this:

Code: Select all
root@max2play-XU4:~# ./fan-status.sh
./fan-status.sh: line 6: /root/odroid-fan-controller.sh status: No such file or directory
^C
root@max2play-XU4:~#


Any one know what's wrong with this code?

It was easy to put this fan on. Has the same pins to mount it to the UU4 board. Can move them right to the holds of it.

Seems to work real good.

So I would like that script to run every min. and show the time for about 24 hours to see if the fan comes on.

Any one know what's wrong with the script?

Looked on line for help "run a script within a script linux" Got it fixed. It's running now. Still shows stopped in the log.

The script looks like this now.

Code: Select all
#!/bin/bash

while true;
do
       echo `date` >> /var/log/odroid-fan-controller.txt
       echo "`/bin/sh /root/odroid-fan-controller.sh status`" >> /var/log/odroid-fan-controller.txt
       sleep 60
done


-Raymond Day
Last edited by Raymond Day on Fri Oct 02, 2015 5:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Raymond Day
 
Posts: 496
Joined: Tue Jun 04, 2013 8:18 pm
Location: Belleville MI
languages_spoken: english
ODROIDs: Odroid-U2, XU4, C1+,

Re: XU4 heatsink without cooler (or low noise)

Unread postby Raymond Day » Fri Oct 02, 2015 4:32 pm

Just got this photo of it.

[img=https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-zHx3UQulwbs/Vg4xglclMNI/AAAAAAAAisU/9mxrdCLxyII/w506-h644/20151002_031425.jpg][/img]

Odroid-XU4 with bigger heatsink.jpg
(149.87 KiB) Downloaded 23743 times


Replaced the small fan on my Odroid-XU4 with this one "Gdstime Aluminum Heatsink for Computer Northbridge Cooler Cooling" got it from http://amzn.com/B00ZRDRX8M I had put the fan back on this new one up-side-down so it would fit. But I have not herd the fan come on yet. Took the thermal interface material off the heatsink that came with it and used it on this new one. It warped the fan a little but still spins. Tested it by hand. Before the fan would come on about every 5 min. for about 5 sec. With it just sitting there doing nothing. Happy this fix that. Can't fit in in the case any more. Could Cut a hole in the top of the case to fit it my do that later. Got Max2Play running on this.

I don't think the fan is coming on at all. But not sure. If I could get that script to work.

Order it on September 21, 2015 and got it on October 1, 2015. 10 days. Seems like it was longer.

-Raymond Day
Raymond Day
 
Posts: 496
Joined: Tue Jun 04, 2013 8:18 pm
Location: Belleville MI
languages_spoken: english
ODROIDs: Odroid-U2, XU4, C1+,

Re: XU4 heatsink without cooler (or low noise)

Unread postby slize12 » Fri Oct 02, 2015 9:12 pm

I would be very interested in this kind of heat sink in operation. Could you please report how the heat sink behaves under heavy load (watching 1080p movies, for instance). I am even wondering if the heatsink it self wouldn't be enough on its own (without the cooler).

Regards
slize
slize12
 
Posts: 7
Joined: Tue Jan 07, 2014 2:01 am
languages_spoken: english

Re: XU4 heatsink without cooler (or low noise)

Unread postby Raymond Day » Fri Oct 02, 2015 10:26 pm

For over 3 hours now the script shows the fan has been stop all the time.

So I did this dd command to make it work hard:

Code: Select all
dd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/null


The fan does turn on then. But it don't make a loud sound any more not being in side a heatsink and I guess because up-side-down too.

Log in another window and did the:

Code: Select all
./odroid-fan-controller.sh status


Still says "Stopped" But it running. So the odroid-fan-controller is not working. Did I wget the wrong one for a Odroid-XU4?

-Raymond Day
Raymond Day
 
Posts: 496
Joined: Tue Jun 04, 2013 8:18 pm
Location: Belleville MI
languages_spoken: english
ODROIDs: Odroid-U2, XU4, C1+,

Re: XU4 heatsink without cooler (or low noise)

Unread postby slize12 » Fri Oct 02, 2015 10:55 pm

Independent of the cooler, what is the temperature of the SoC?

Try
Code: Select all
cat /sys/devices/10060000.tmu/temp


Did / do you run any performance intensive tasks?
slize12
 
Posts: 7
Joined: Tue Jan 07, 2014 2:01 am
languages_spoken: english

Re: XU4 heatsink without cooler (or low noise)

Unread postby Raymond Day » Sat Oct 03, 2015 1:05 am

If I use that script and say turn on the fan it sort of like clicks movies a tinny bit over and over. Like it's not getting power good.

If I run the DD test the fan spins up about right away. I felt the heatsink and it stays nice and cool.

As soon as I stop the DD the fan stop all most right away too.

But I just found out I messed up the 2 USB 3.0 ports some how.

Used a pointed pliers to get off the pets holding the old heatsink on. Looked at the board and it looked good.

Going to have look at the heatsink maybe I don't have it in the right place. I thought I put it in just were the other was. The food print is the same as the one that came off. I do have the same film between the bottom and board. I may of starched it out some getting it off the other one.

Plug that USB sound in the USB 2.0 port and it's working now.

Some time will see if I can see why the USB 3.0 ports are not working now. It must have something to do with me putting on that bigger heatsink.

If I did this again I would of just cut off the old pins. The new one came with new ones any way.

I know about that command. Been playing music on it and it shows like this:

r
Code: Select all
oot@max2play-XU4:~# cat /sys/devices/10060000.tmu/temp
sensor0 : 50000
sensor1 : 48000
sensor2 : 52000
sensor3 : 51000
sensor4 : 47000
root@max2play-XU4:~#


All so I can not heat the fan any more when it does come on. It must be because it's in side the heatsink that came with it makes it sound loud. Or it my be that I have it blowing the other way now with this new big heatsink.

-Raymond Day
Raymond Day
 
Posts: 496
Joined: Tue Jun 04, 2013 8:18 pm
Location: Belleville MI
languages_spoken: english
ODROIDs: Odroid-U2, XU4, C1+,

Re: XU4 heatsink without cooler (or low noise)

Unread postby campbell » Sat Oct 03, 2015 7:06 am

Just finished putting together a new XU4 with the C1 heatsink and I am quite impressed at the idle power draw. With just serial comms and no ethernet or wifi, at an ambient temperature of about 23 C, it's drawing 1.389 W with a core temp of 40 C. It's clearly doing a better job of moving heat away from the CPU without the fan on than the default heatsink with fan.
campbell
 
Posts: 287
Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2015 1:13 pm
languages_spoken: english
ODROIDs: XU3, XU4, C2, C1+, Cloudshell, Smart Power

Re: XU4 heatsink without cooler (or low noise)

Unread postby Raymond Day » Sat Oct 03, 2015 8:26 am

I had mine running for hours with a DD command test. I tested the temp it looked like this.

Code: Select all
root@max2play-XU4:~# cat /sys/devices/10060000.tmu/temp
sensor0 : 50000
sensor1 : 48000
sensor2 : 52000
sensor3 : 51000
sensor4 : 47000
root@max2play-XU4:~# cat /sys/devices/10060000.tmu/temp
sensor0 : 50000
sensor1 : 48000
sensor2 : 52000
sensor3 : 51000
sensor4 : 47000
root@max2play-XU4:~# cat /sys/devices/10060000.tmu/temp
sensor0 : 50000
sensor1 : 48000
sensor2 : 52000
sensor3 : 51000
sensor4 : 47000
root@max2play-XU4:~# cat /sys/devices/10060000.tmu/temp
sensor0 : 65000
sensor1 : 54000
sensor2 : 57000
sensor3 : 58000
sensor4 : 54000
root@max2play-XU4:~# cat /sys/devices/10060000.tmu/temp
sensor0 : 65000
sensor1 : 54000
sensor2 : 57000
sensor3 : 58000
sensor4 : 54000
root@max2play-XU4:~# cat /sys/devices/10060000.tmu/temp
sensor0 : 62000
sensor1 : 51000
sensor2 : 54000
sensor3 : 55000
sensor4 : 51000
root@max2play-XU4:~# cat /sys/devices/10060000.tmu/temp
sensor0 : 61000
sensor1 : 50000
sensor2 : 53000
sensor3 : 54000
sensor4 : 50000
root@max2play-XU4:~# cat /sys/devices/10060000.tmu/temp
sensor0 : 45000
sensor1 : 43000
sensor2 : 46000
sensor3 : 46000
sensor4 : 42000
root@max2play-XU4:~# cat /sys/devices/10060000.tmu/temp
sensor0 : 49000
sensor1 : 47000
sensor2 : 51000
sensor3 : 50000
sensor4 : 46000
root@max2play-XU4:~#


The 1ST one before I did the DD command to have it work hard.

The 2nd to last is when I stop the DD command and the very last one is with the DD command not running for about 1/2 a hour.

The DD command looked like this when I stop it with CTRL C.

Code: Select all
root@max2play-XU4:~# dd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/null
^C12449493752+0 records in
12449493752+0 records out
6374140801024 bytes (6.4 TB) copied, 16924.8 s, 377 MB/s

root@max2play-XU4:~#


Does the temps look good?

I can hear the fan some. Now with no other sound in my room. But still not as loud as it was with the heatsink that came with it.

-Raymond Day
Raymond Day
 
Posts: 496
Joined: Tue Jun 04, 2013 8:18 pm
Location: Belleville MI
languages_spoken: english
ODROIDs: Odroid-U2, XU4, C1+,

Re: XU4 heatsink without cooler (or low noise)

Unread postby Raymond Day » Sat Oct 03, 2015 8:27 am

I guess have the wrong script go test the status of the fan for the XU4 how can I find the right one? If there is one.

-Raymond Day
Raymond Day
 
Posts: 496
Joined: Tue Jun 04, 2013 8:18 pm
Location: Belleville MI
languages_spoken: english
ODROIDs: Odroid-U2, XU4, C1+,

Re: XU4 heatsink without cooler (or low noise)

Unread postby odroid » Sat Oct 03, 2015 1:57 pm

I think the sysbench is a better way to make more heavier computing load on 8-cores instead of the simple dd command.
Also use the "htop" to monitor the load of 8-cores.
User avatar
odroid
Site Admin
 
Posts: 28610
Joined: Fri Feb 22, 2013 11:14 pm
languages_spoken: English
ODROIDs: ODROID

Re: XU4 heatsink without cooler (or low noise)

Unread postby rleefpi » Sat Oct 03, 2015 2:12 pm

There's peltier plates that will fit on top or below the odroid, but it will require custom modification to deliver power to the plate and transfer heat off the hot side of the plate.

edit: You can also find waterblocks that will fit on the XU4's 5422 which is also ideal for experimenting and hacking on 5422 cluster banks with XU4.
rleefpi
 
Posts: 30
Joined: Tue Sep 29, 2015 5:24 pm
languages_spoken: english

Re: XU4 heatsink without cooler (or low noise)

Unread postby Raymond Day » Sat Oct 03, 2015 6:20 pm

For got about the htop. I just did it and tested with the DD command. It only uses one core at a time. I open another log in and did the same DD command and then it used another core. They both were at a 100%.

-Raymond Day
Raymond Day
 
Posts: 496
Joined: Tue Jun 04, 2013 8:18 pm
Location: Belleville MI
languages_spoken: english
ODROIDs: Odroid-U2, XU4, C1+,

Re: XU4 heatsink without cooler (or low noise)

Unread postby dronus » Sat Oct 03, 2015 9:26 pm

Well I just found out first easiest solution for going passive for moderate workloads is just to remove the fan and turn down core frequencys.

I had raised the kick-in temperature of my fan to 75 degree, and then tuned the max. core frequencies until the fan is almost never running.That already worked quite well for my usage.

Today I just removed the fan from the heatsink. Running wihout case, the temperature with my workload dropped from 75 to 63 degree, giving me new headroom for core frequency.


Maybe I'l do a small heat-dependent automatic cpu/gpu throttler these days, then I can log what frequencies are achievable running passively with the stock heatsink.
dronus
 
Posts: 86
Joined: Fri Jul 25, 2014 7:24 pm
languages_spoken: english
ODROIDs: U3, XU4, C1+

Re: XU4 heatsink without cooler (or low noise)

Unread postby dronus » Mon Oct 05, 2015 1:05 am

I just run a 300% in total workload on the fast cores and heavy GPU usage at mild ambient temperatures, having all throttles removed despite having the GPU one level down (as there are some clues that 600 mhz aren't always reliable independent of temperature) It runs reliable for about 8 hours, just scraping but as far as I checked it never triggering the 95 degree trip point.

So just removing the fan altogether was a very good idea so far :-)
dronus
 
Posts: 86
Joined: Fri Jul 25, 2014 7:24 pm
languages_spoken: english
ODROIDs: U3, XU4, C1+

Re: XU4 heatsink without cooler (or low noise)

Unread postby rikc » Wed Oct 21, 2015 2:41 am

Ok, so after some more searching I got this heatsink:

http://www.ebay.nl/itm/Aluminum-Heatsin ... 1518718878

Big advantage: It has the mounting holes that fit the Odroid

Disadvantage: It was slightly too big (45x45mm)!

But that was something that was fixed by some filing and a metal saw.

These are the temperatures it's now runing at:

Idling,

odroid@odroid:~$ sudo cat /sys/devices/10060000.tmu/temp
sensor0 : 48000
sensor1 : 45000
sensor2 : 50000
sensor3 : 51000
sensor4 : 46000

Playing some 1080p Youtube content via Chromium (stuttering)

odroid@odroid:~$ sudo cat /sys/devices/10060000.tmu/temp
sensor0 : 86000
sensor1 : 80000
sensor2 : 93000
sensor3 : 93000
sensor4 : 73000

It's probably ~2-3 degrees lower colder now in my house since it's now autumn instead of summer but these temperatures are clearly lower than before and much more important passive and without an enormous cooler!

Picture 1

Picture 2

Next I'll modify the case a bit to make it all fit.
rikc
 
Posts: 9
Joined: Mon Aug 17, 2015 10:43 pm
languages_spoken: english, dutch, german, french
ODROIDs: XU4

Re: XU4 heatsink without cooler (or low noise)

Unread postby rikc » Sun Oct 25, 2015 1:20 am

Image

Image

Now with a modified case!
rikc
 
Posts: 9
Joined: Mon Aug 17, 2015 10:43 pm
languages_spoken: english, dutch, german, french
ODROIDs: XU4

Re: XU4 heatsink without cooler (or low noise)

Unread postby glenenglish » Mon Nov 16, 2015 7:12 am

So here is what I did. The fan never runs for 20deg C ambient, Even with sustained heavy load of all the NEON units of the 4 x BIG cores. (clock = 1800MHz)
The box (pictured) gets warm- that is what we want.

I am using Bergquist GAPPAD VO ULTRASOFT. I have 2mm and 1.5mm in stock.
I mount the board on 4 x M3 x 5mm high standoffs. 4mm would be better but there is insufficient clearance to the fan pegs
I use 2 x 2mm and 1 x 1.5mm thick GAPPAD (5.5mm) total.

The GAPPAD MUST have some compression/pressure for it to work. This is a tenuous requirement because the XU PCBs are very thin and if one is not careful the deformation of the pcb will break things. . For more serious applications, I would have alot of screws around the compression area , AND/OR pressure from above (usually from the lid of the box ).

The 5.5mm stack of gappad was about 5.8mm high, so I added a single set of M3 flat washers underneath as to make the PCB stand off about 5.3mm.
Just enough to get a very slight squash.
Pushing down on the middle of the board will produce sufficient compression, do it evenly and slowly.

ODROID- suggest some more room around the middle fan-attachment pin so that I can not use the fan, but put an additional standoff and hold down nut& bolt - to fit a nut on top - M2.5 or M2 would be fine (but M2 would required smaller hole). ALso needs clearance underneath to sit on the standoff. ground is ok- doesn't have to be ground isolated.

gappad.jpg
(197.32 KiB) Downloaded 21367 times

box.jpg
(188.88 KiB) Downloaded 21367 times
glenenglish
 
Posts: 27
Joined: Thu Feb 19, 2015 6:26 pm
languages_spoken: english
ODROIDs: 118 x C1s
3 x XU4, 5 x C2

Re: XU4 heatsink without cooler (or low noise)

Unread postby odroid » Thu Nov 19, 2015 10:09 am

Is that GAP-PAD used as a Thermal-Interface-Material(TIM) between your metal case and XU4?

We are also very interested in fan-less XU4 system.
So please share any passive cooler option you found.

Anyway, we will try to increase the clearance near the cooler mounting hole as much as we can.
But we may need to move the USB 3.0 hub controller and its related 5Ghz signal circuits. :(
User avatar
odroid
Site Admin
 
Posts: 28610
Joined: Fri Feb 22, 2013 11:14 pm
languages_spoken: English
ODROIDs: ODROID

Re: XU4 heatsink without cooler (or low noise)

Unread postby luxmile » Thu Nov 19, 2015 10:22 am

like this (since odroid forum has no favorites feature)...
luxmile
 
Posts: 33
Joined: Wed Feb 25, 2015 10:52 am
languages_spoken: english

Re: XU4 heatsink without cooler (or low noise)

Unread postby glenenglish » Fri Nov 20, 2015 8:11 pm

The TIM is Bergquist . But other types are probably as good.

http://www.bergquistcompany.com/thermal ... raSoft.htm

Digikey : BER224-ND, BER223-ND, BER225-ND, BER226-ND .. etc they have alot of different thicknesses. You need to fiddle the thicknesses knowing for very thick (4 or 5 mm) you probably have to stack two different types to get the right amount of squash.

I think the hole near the USB hub ctrl is OK, but just needs enough clearance for a cap- head screw (M2, M2.5 and underneath could use a nylon compression washer for insulation.
Have a look and see what you think. If you could get clearance for an M2,5 or M3 standoff underneath that would be good. Even M2 for this single standoff- others can be M3.
It is OK for the single to be M2 if this means space and PCB are unmodified.

I could have used a 4mm high standoff which is much better than a 5mm standoff IF I had removed the fan pegs. I only had 5mm high M3 standoffs in stock

The TIM is of course deg-C/W per mm thickness, so going from 5mm to 4 mm would be a big improvement on thermal conductivity (and next time I would use 4mm height ) .

To use 4mm probably means a single threaded M3 spacer x 4mm on the four mounting posts and the M2 for the middle one .

something like Hirosugi : http://hirosugi.jp/

http://hirosugi.jp/products/POM/AS.html

Maybe a fan can stay , also in case it got really really hot..... then use a bolt in place of the fan plastic snap in down onto a standoff in the middle. I will modify mine and see how it looks next week.
glenenglish
 
Posts: 27
Joined: Thu Feb 19, 2015 6:26 pm
languages_spoken: english
ODROIDs: 118 x C1s
3 x XU4, 5 x C2

Re: XU4 heatsink without cooler (or low noise)

Unread postby AdrianBc » Sat Nov 21, 2015 10:11 pm

I want to share my experience with ODROID XU4, because it might be useful for others.

In the last few days it was used almost all day doing software video scaling (because I could not find an appropriate player that would know to use the GPU of XU4) from 480 lines (from an USB TV tuner) to 1080 lines.

It worked fine, but the cores were overheating, the four A15 cores oscillated continuously between 0.9 GHz and 2 GHz because the temperature of 96 degrees was reached quickly at the maximum frequency.

I was concerned about the long term reliability of ODROID XU4 at this temperature, so, after reading the previous posts I decided to replace the TIM sheet from under the heatsink with high quality thermal paste.

I order to remove the heatsink I had to cut the 2 plastic rods that attach it to the PCB. In order to detach the heatsink from the surface of the integrated circuits without damaging them, I applied gentle twisting motions to the heatsink until it separated from the integrated circuits. Pulling the heatsink instead of twisting might detach the integrated circuits from the PCB instead of detaching the heatsink.

I removed the TIM sheet from the heatsink, leaving the bare metal surface. I covered the surface of Exynos 5422 and the surface of the other 2 small integrated circuits with Noctua NT-H1 thermal paste, which is electrically insulating so there are no risks to create short-circuits on the PCB. Because the heatsink cannot be pressed very well on the integrated circuits I have put a thicker layer of paste than I would have put on a CPU for a desktop socket. I pressed once the heatsink and I verified that contact was achieved on the entire surface, than I pressed it back in its final position.

Normally I should have searched for a pair of screws that would fit in the 2 holes of the heatsink, to attach it again to the PCB, but I was lazy and I used a piece of insulated wire, the kind that is used for tying plants. I passed it through the 2 holes and across the back of the PCB and I tied it above the PCB, on one of the sides of the heatsink. The attachment seemed solid enough and I could mount the PCB again in the ODROID case without problems.

The result is that now, running continuously the same mplayer with software video scaling, the four A15 cores remain all the time at 2 GHz but the temperature is lower with about 30 degrees than before, oscillating between 60 and 66 degrees.

Of course the noise is also much lower, because the fan spins much more slowly.

I am grateful to the previous posts, because they helped me decide quickly how to solve the overheating problem and shared here for others that might encounter the same problem.
AdrianBc
 
Posts: 3
Joined: Sat Nov 21, 2015 9:33 pm
languages_spoken: english
ODROIDs: ODROID XU4

Re: XU4 heatsink without cooler (or low noise)

Unread postby Triluch » Sun Nov 22, 2015 7:03 am

@AdrianBc

I have just tried same method.
You can also remove Odroid's XU4 heatsink without breaking plastic rods, they are 'anchored', so you just need to squeeze them from the bottom and pull the top, then you can put heatsink back without resorting to screws or wires ;)
I didn't achieve as good result as yours (I have used Pactum PT-1 paste, and probably less than you, because that one isn't electrically insulating), but still temperatures during compilation dropped from ~93-95 to 75-80 and there was no more throttling to 0.9 GHz, according to energy monitor, so it was a valid method for me.
Triluch
 
Posts: 1
Joined: Sun Nov 22, 2015 6:51 am
languages_spoken: english, polish
ODROIDs: Odroid U2, Odroid XU4

Re: XU4 heatsink without cooler (or low noise)

Unread postby glenenglish » Sun Nov 22, 2015 7:11 am

Good work

If you use the Bergquist Gap-pad VO Ultrasoft between the fan-heatsink and the PCB, you should get much much better transfer because the gap-pad is conformal.
It is very very soft and designed to be able to mould around chip components.

That is, it will contact both PCB and the chips, and no thermal paste is required.

glen
glenenglish
 
Posts: 27
Joined: Thu Feb 19, 2015 6:26 pm
languages_spoken: english
ODROIDs: 118 x C1s
3 x XU4, 5 x C2

Re: XU4 heatsink without cooler (or low noise)

Unread postby AdrianBc » Sun Nov 22, 2015 9:13 pm

@Triluch

You are of course perfectly right. I actually tried initially to remove the plastic rods by compressing the anchors and pulling them through the holes.

I am very familiar with this kind of plastic anchors, because many years ago this was the standard method for attaching motherboards to cases. For some reason this method went out of fashion about a dozen years ago.

Nevertheless, for my ODROID XU4 PCB, the rod extraction seemed to require excessive force. Maybe I had, by chance, holes smaller than average or anchors larger than average.

Anyway, I did not want to risk any kind of damage to the XU4 PCB by excessive bending of the PCB during rod extraction, so I preferred to cut the plastic anchors with a cutter. This operation does not stress the PCB in any way.

@glenenglish

Of course, the Bergquist pads mentioned by you might also be OK. I did not buy Noctua NT-H1 for the ODROID. I happened to have it in my home as a remainder from the assembly of some ATX motherboard.

As this paste was thus proved to work very well, I reported the temperature numbers for others who might happen to also have it.

It is probable that any high-quality thermal pastes or thermal pads would greatly improve the cooling efficiency compared to the stock TIM used under the aluminum heatsink. The only point that requires attention is that the use of electrically-conductive pastes (e.g. silver-filled) should be avoided unless great care is taken when applying the paste so that it would not reach the leads of the IC packages or the PCB.
AdrianBc
 
Posts: 3
Joined: Sat Nov 21, 2015 9:33 pm
languages_spoken: english
ODROIDs: ODROID XU4

Re: XU4 heatsink without cooler (or low noise)

Unread postby dox81 » Wed Nov 25, 2015 4:27 pm

@AdrianBc @Triluch

Do you guys get these temperatures having the cover on of off?
I changed the paste(NT-H1) only in the cpu area, leaving the TIM in all other areas. I was afraid to remove all because @odroid said it may cause some issues having the heatsink touching other components without TIM.
Anyway, I got a good improvement on high load. It never reacher 90 degrees now. With the cover on, idle temps are pretty much the same, unfortunately(~60 degrees). How is it on your side?
dox81
 
Posts: 28
Joined: Wed Feb 04, 2015 1:53 am
languages_spoken: english
ODROIDs: XU4

Re: XU4 heatsink without cooler (or low noise)

Unread postby AdrianBc » Thu Nov 26, 2015 6:08 am

@dox81

The reported temperatures are with the XU4 PCB completely enclosed in its original case (the clear variant). The ODROID XU4 is connected to a FullHD monitor and to a Gb Ethernet network and has a TV tuner on one of the USB ports. The room temperature is 25 degrees Celsius.

I assume that "sensor0" is on the processor, because it always shows the maximum temperature. With XU4 running mplayer with software video scaling from 480 lines to 1080 lines, "sensor0" oscillates between 60 and 66 degrees. The other 4 sensors show temperatures between 55 and 60 degrees, never exceeding 60 degrees.

Previously "sensor0" reached 96 degrees immediately, the fan was very noisy and "syslog" and "kern.log" filled quickly the entire flash memory space with thermal messages, until I noticed that and limited their size. Now the fan is quiet enough, there are no more thermal messages in the logs and cpufreq-info shows that all 8 cores have stayed at their maximum clock frequencies (1.4 GHz for A7 and 2.0 GHz for A15) during 99.9% of the time.

When I stop mplayer and XU4 remains idle, after some time needed for cooling, the fan stops and all 5 sensors drop to 50 degrees or less.

I have removed completely the TIM sheet and I have put a relatively thick layer of NT-H1 on all 3 integrated circuits. When I pressed down the heatsink it did not seem to touch any other component besides the integrated circuits. If it would touch other components, that would definitely be a mistake in the PCB design. I assume that no such undesired contact occurs, at least in my case, because the XU4 has already worked fine for almost a week after this modification, being stressed continuously for 16 hours each day.
AdrianBc
 
Posts: 3
Joined: Sat Nov 21, 2015 9:33 pm
languages_spoken: english
ODROIDs: ODROID XU4

Re: XU4 heatsink without cooler (or low noise)

Unread postby dox81 » Thu Nov 26, 2015 6:14 am

I saw two other small integrated circuits that made contact with the TIM and I was afraid to remove it completely. Hope it was a good decision. Other than this, I plan to change the fan with the Noctua that was mentioned on this forum.

From what I figured out, sensor 2 is the CPU on my side (using Arch). Only sensor 2 matches the temp from the below command. I use it to check the temperature of the cpu:

cat /sys/devices/virtual/thermal/thermal_zone0/temp
dox81
 
Posts: 28
Joined: Wed Feb 04, 2015 1:53 am
languages_spoken: english
ODROIDs: XU4

Re: XU4 heatsink without cooler (or low noise)

Unread postby shimo » Mon Nov 30, 2015 3:00 pm

I'm in the process of replacing my XU-4's heatsink, and I just have to share this absolute gem I found while doing research:

Image
shimo
 
Posts: 4
Joined: Mon Nov 30, 2015 2:49 pm
languages_spoken: english
ODROIDs: C1+, C2, XU4

Next

Return to Hardware and peripherals

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest