ODROID-C3

Share here your ideas for new projects

Moderators: odroid, meveric, mdrjr

Re: ODROID-C3

Unread postby jiffysound » Tue Aug 22, 2017 8:12 pm

I would like to see more ram in the Odroid C3, I know that RAM costs are high for the TCO compared to other peripherals but there have been many times when a program crapped out on me due to high ram usage and the swap file filled up to the max.
jiffysound
 
Posts: 63
Joined: Wed Sep 07, 2016 9:49 pm
languages_spoken: english
ODROIDs: odroid c2

Re: ODROID-C3

Unread postby ConteZero » Sat Aug 26, 2017 5:06 am

More RAM, it's a no brainer.

I think that the best way to work this "I want more" is with a PCIe 1x (or equivalent) "unpowered" header.
You want USB3 ? USB3 shield.
You want SATA ? SATA shield.
You want (add your stuff here) ? PCIe header to PCIe slot shield adapter.
ConteZero
 
Posts: 5
Joined: Sat Apr 16, 2016 2:42 am
languages_spoken: english italian

Re: ODROID-C3

Unread postby nobe » Mon Aug 28, 2017 6:25 pm

we might have a winner here : https://www.cnx-software.com/2016/03/10 ... ent-545548
not much information yet, but that's the only info related to a future amlogic soc i've seen so far

or maybe a real new successor to S905, who knows ?
nobe
 
Posts: 121
Joined: Sun Feb 07, 2016 9:52 pm
languages_spoken: english, french
ODROIDs: Odroid-C2

Re: ODROID-C3

Unread postby crashoverride » Tue Aug 29, 2017 8:05 am

I noticed that post on CNX too and I was genuinely excited by it. However, a lot still remains unknown. I hope that Amlogic has designed IOMMU support into it. The C2 is still unmatched for its price/performance when it comes to 4k@60 media.
crashoverride
 
Posts: 4130
Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2014 8:42 pm
languages_spoken: english
ODROIDs: C1

Re: ODROID-C3

Unread postby nobe » Sat Sep 02, 2017 8:43 pm

i just found something interesting... amlogic might already have the soc we are all waiting for : amlogic T966 !
http://www.amlogic.com/#Products/275/index.html
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amlogic#Comparison_table

so it has good amlogic vpu, gigabit ethernet, quad A53 as CPU and mali T830 MP2 as GPU.
this means the gpu :
- has modern midgard architecture
- supports all nice features like opencl, vulkan and afbc
- is theorically up to 50% more powerfull than S905 gpu (see http://kyokojap.myweb.hinet.net/gpu_gflops/)

unfortunately i couldn't find any information on max RAM nor USB3 support for T966...
but here comes the interesting part : https://web.archive.org/web/20150202100 ... duct01.htm

this old amlogic website archive shows that T866 could support up to 4GB RAM and has usb3 supports
so my guess is that T966, being T866 successor, might have the same nice features which would have made T966 the perfect candidate for C3

now the question is : why didn't this happen ?

edit :
it seems T966 really supports usb3 and at least 3GB ram
it is used in some xiaomi TVs : https://www.displayspecifications.com/f ... /63981db6d
nobe
 
Posts: 121
Joined: Sun Feb 07, 2016 9:52 pm
languages_spoken: english, french
ODROIDs: Odroid-C2

Re: ODROID-C3

Unread postby crashoverride » Sun Sep 03, 2017 9:50 am

I think the T series is for devices that directly drive a display panel (Smart TV/projector). This implies they have no HDMI output hardware.
crashoverride
 
Posts: 4130
Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2014 8:42 pm
languages_spoken: english
ODROIDs: C1

Re: ODROID-C3

Unread postby nobe » Sun Sep 03, 2017 4:29 pm

humm, yes and no

they do target smart TVs/Projectors market

but they still have hdmi 2.0a output (i think their special feature is triple hdmi input) :
- https://www.geniatech.com/product/apc1966/
- http://www.amlogic.com/#Application/Pro ... dex02.html (scroll down, click "processors" tab, scroll down again, then the comparison table states : "Video Interface | HDMI 2.0 and CVBS input and output")

though, considering the targeted markets, i fear this is an "android only" soc
nobe
 
Posts: 121
Joined: Sun Feb 07, 2016 9:52 pm
languages_spoken: english, french
ODROIDs: Odroid-C2

Re: ODROID-C3

Unread postby nobe » Mon Sep 04, 2017 5:20 pm

nobe wrote:i fear this is an "android only" soc

i was wrong, this soc seems to be linux-supported (v3.10) by amlogic : https://github.com/LibreELEC/linux-amlo ... 66_skt.dts
so codename is gxtvbb, other relevant files are mesongxtvbb.dtsi and mesongxtvbb-gpu-t83x.dtsi

to be honest, T966 is the best odroid-c3 soc candidate i've seen so far (modulo its price of course)
nobe
 
Posts: 121
Joined: Sun Feb 07, 2016 9:52 pm
languages_spoken: english, french
ODROIDs: Odroid-C2

Re: ODROID-C3

Unread postby boolean » Thu Sep 21, 2017 4:59 am

Whatever the specs are, PLEASE let it have a mainline kernel and modules...
boolean
 
Posts: 4
Joined: Thu Aug 31, 2017 8:27 am
languages_spoken: english
ODROIDs: C2

Re: ODROID-C3

Unread postby crashoverride » Thu Sep 21, 2017 6:21 am

boolean wrote:PLEASE let it have a mainline kernel and modules...

This would make it useless as a media device. Mainline kernel lacks too many features to make a usable media ARM SBC.

When C2 was launched, support HDMI2.0, AFBC, CEC, h265, etc. were not present in Linux. As I mentioned elsewhere, nobody can just "add stuff to the mainline". It has to go through a "chain of command" where maintainers will "get around to it" at their leisure. Sometimes, as in the case of AFBC and CEC, a new "linux-ism" must be created taking far more additional time. All this combines into the axiom: "mainline only well supports obsolete hardware".

For those that do not care about media features, mainline can already be run today in a virtual machine (VM) on C2. C2 has supported VM operation since public launch. An example is running Ubuntu in a VM where distro and kernel updates are all provided by Ubuntu.

Today, mainline focuses on x86 server hardware. Desktop (graphics/media) support is a "2nd class citizen" in Linux. This situation is not unique to ARM. I see this even today for Intel Skylake boards. By the time Skylake is fully supported, it will be obsolete.
crashoverride
 
Posts: 4130
Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2014 8:42 pm
languages_spoken: english
ODROIDs: C1

Re: ODROID-C3

Unread postby elatllat » Thu Sep 21, 2017 10:29 am

crashoverride wrote:..."mainline only well supports obsolete hardware"...

To quantify that it takes about a month to get good code into the mainline kernel, the main issue normally is people write bad code and then don't attempt to fix it upon review, so it never gets in... basically because there is no ROI for a company to use mainline instead of there own fork.

crashoverride wrote:...skylake...

was buggy hardware no matter the OS.
elatllat
 
Posts: 1093
Joined: Tue Sep 01, 2015 8:54 am
languages_spoken: english
ODROIDs: XU4, N1

Re: ODROID-C3

Unread postby campbell » Wed Nov 29, 2017 4:56 am

Has anyone looked at the Samsumg S5P6818 (used in a bunch of NanoPi/NanoPC devices) ? It's an eight-core Cortex A53 with an RTC. Which gives it a nice performance bump over the C2 and re-adds one of the key features the C1+ had that the C2 took away (and yes, I have used the RTC shields for the C2, and they're a pain in the ass on both the HW and SW side, and don't even work with mainline kernel)
campbell
 
Posts: 309
Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2015 1:13 pm
languages_spoken: english
ODROIDs: XU3, XU4, C2, C1+, Cloudshell, Smart Power

Re: ODROID-C3

Unread postby meveric » Wed Nov 29, 2017 7:26 am

campbell wrote:It's an eight-core Cortex A53 with an RTC. Which gives it a nice performance bump over the C2

On the contrary.
More cores does not mean better performance, in fact compared to the C2 you would loose quite some performance compared to the S5P6818.
The C2 has a default clock of 1.5 GHz while the S5P6818 is clocked at 1.4 GHz, given that you can overclock the C2 up to 2GHz the difference is even greater.
Single core performance is often much more important than a higher number of cores.
Also the S5P6818 only has 1080p resolution and video decoding support, while the C2 has 4k.
The S5P6818 only has eMMC 4.5 support, the C2 has eMMC 5.0 which is much faster.

So overall you probably loose quite a bit on performance if you would use the S5P6818 compared to the C2.
On the other hand, if better drivers are available for the S5P6818 than for the C2 some of the downsides might work better anyway due to better GPU support, or something similar.

8 cores also mean a lot more heat, which is probably the reason why it's only clocked at 1.4 GHz while most Cortex-A53 SoCs are clocked at 1.5 Ghz.
Donate to support my work on the ODROID GameStation Turbo Image for U2/U3 XU3/XU4 X2 X C1 as well as many other releases.
Check out the Games and Emulators section to find some of my work or check the files in my repository to find the software i build for ODROIDs.
If you want to add my repository to your image read my HOWTO integrate my repo into your image.
User avatar
meveric
 
Posts: 9424
Joined: Mon Feb 25, 2013 2:41 pm
languages_spoken: german, english
ODROIDs: X2, U2, U3, XU-Lite, XU3, XU3-Lite, C1, XU4, C2, C1+, XU4Q, HC1, N1, Go

Re: ODROID-C3

Unread postby campbell » Wed Nov 29, 2017 7:30 am

meveric wrote:you can overclock the C2 up to 2GHz

That's being VERY generous...but your other points are well made.

(side note: all of the code I run on the C2 scales nearly linearly in performance with the number of cores, and the parts that don't are limited by DRAM speed, not eMMC speed)
campbell
 
Posts: 309
Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2015 1:13 pm
languages_spoken: english
ODROIDs: XU3, XU4, C2, C1+, Cloudshell, Smart Power

Re: ODROID-C3

Unread postby meveric » Wed Nov 29, 2017 7:37 am

campbell wrote:
meveric wrote:you can overclock the C2 up to 2GHz

That's being VERY generous...but your other points are well made.

If you check the boot.ini of the C2, if you have an updated version or if you check the latest one online: https://github.com/mdrjr/c2_bootini/blo ... #L145-L154 you'll see that 2GHz is a possibility, but even 1.7GHz should be a lot faster than 1.4 in most cases.

campbell wrote:(side note: all of the code I run on the C2 scales nearly linearly in performance with the number of cores, and the parts that don't are limited by DRAM speed, not eMMC speed)

That really depends on the programs you run, there are program that are able to use multiple threads, but from my experience most application (or games in particular) don't make use of multiple cores, but rather require a higher single core performance.
For example emulation. More cores won't help you with most emulators, higher CPU power instead may work wonders.
But I agree that there are programs that can make use of more CPU cores, depending on what you want to run on it.
Donate to support my work on the ODROID GameStation Turbo Image for U2/U3 XU3/XU4 X2 X C1 as well as many other releases.
Check out the Games and Emulators section to find some of my work or check the files in my repository to find the software i build for ODROIDs.
If you want to add my repository to your image read my HOWTO integrate my repo into your image.
User avatar
meveric
 
Posts: 9424
Joined: Mon Feb 25, 2013 2:41 pm
languages_spoken: german, english
ODROIDs: X2, U2, U3, XU-Lite, XU3, XU3-Lite, C1, XU4, C2, C1+, XU4Q, HC1, N1, Go

Re: ODROID-C3

Unread postby campbell » Wed Nov 29, 2017 7:47 am

meveric wrote:
campbell wrote:
meveric wrote:you can overclock the C2 up to 2GHz

That's being VERY generous...but your other points are well made.

If you check the boot.ini of the C2, if you have an updated version or if you check the latest one online: https://github.com/mdrjr/c2_bootini/blo ... #L145-L154 you'll see that 2GHz is a possibility, but even 1.7GHz should be a lot faster than 1.4 in most cases.

Yes, but according to the wiki referenced by that ini file, anything over 1.656 GHz requires 3 of the 4 cores to be shut off for it to be unconditionally stable. I would venture to say most users WILL notice a decrease in responsiveness going from multiple cores to a single core, even if that core is a bit faster.
campbell
 
Posts: 309
Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2015 1:13 pm
languages_spoken: english
ODROIDs: XU3, XU4, C2, C1+, Cloudshell, Smart Power

Re: ODROID-C3

Unread postby meveric » Wed Nov 29, 2017 8:40 am

campbell wrote:Yes, but according to the wiki referenced by that ini file, anything over 1.656 GHz requires 3 of the 4 cores to be shut off for it to be unconditionally stable. I would venture to say most users WILL notice a decrease in responsiveness going from multiple cores to a single core, even if that core is a bit faster.

Not sure where you read this, but that's far from being true. Especially 3 out of 4 cores turned off? Come on you don't actually believe this, do you?
I remember some people saying that in higher values you have to turn off 1 or 2 cores, but not 3 out of 4 that's ridiculous.
I run my C2 at 1752 MHz on 4 cores for many months (probably nearly a year by now) without any stability issues. I use the ODROID for heavy compiling, so I use all 4 cores simultaneously.
Donate to support my work on the ODROID GameStation Turbo Image for U2/U3 XU3/XU4 X2 X C1 as well as many other releases.
Check out the Games and Emulators section to find some of my work or check the files in my repository to find the software i build for ODROIDs.
If you want to add my repository to your image read my HOWTO integrate my repo into your image.
User avatar
meveric
 
Posts: 9424
Joined: Mon Feb 25, 2013 2:41 pm
languages_spoken: german, english
ODROIDs: X2, U2, U3, XU-Lite, XU3, XU3-Lite, C1, XU4, C2, C1+, XU4Q, HC1, N1, Go

Re: ODROID-C3

Unread postby campbell » Wed Nov 29, 2017 9:04 am

meveric wrote:
campbell wrote:Yes, but according to the wiki referenced by that ini file, anything over 1.656 GHz requires 3 of the 4 cores to be shut off for it to be unconditionally stable. I would venture to say most users WILL notice a decrease in responsiveness going from multiple cores to a single core, even if that core is a bit faster.

Not sure where you read this, but that's far from being true. Especially 3 out of 4 cores turned off? Come on you don't actually believe this, do you?
I remember some people saying that in higher values you have to turn off 1 or 2 cores, but not 3 out of 4 that's ridiculous.
I run my C2 at 1752 MHz on 4 cores for many months (probably nearly a year by now) without any stability issues. I use the ODROID for heavy compiling, so I use all 4 cores simultaneously.

I'm just quoting from the wiki. Click on the link you sent me, scroll up a few lines, and follow the link: http://odroid.com/dokuwiki/doku.php?id= ... t_cpu_freq
campbell
 
Posts: 309
Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2015 1:13 pm
languages_spoken: english
ODROIDs: XU3, XU4, C2, C1+, Cloudshell, Smart Power

Re: ODROID-C3

Unread postby crashoverride » Thu Jan 11, 2018 7:58 am

Since nobody has mentioned it yet, CNX posted an updated Amlogic roadmap:
https://www.cnx-software.com/2018/01/10/amlogic-2018-roadmap-reveals-s905x2-s905c-and-s922-processors/

The S905X2 looks like a likely candidate for a C2 upgrade. This is, of course, if they added USB3 to it (not mentioned on slide). Since there is mention of "Next Gen process", it will likely offer increased operating speeds.
crashoverride
 
Posts: 4130
Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2014 8:42 pm
languages_spoken: english
ODROIDs: C1

Re: ODROID-C3

Unread postby odroid » Thu Jan 11, 2018 9:13 am

It looks very promising.
We will check whether it is suitable for C3 or not.
User avatar
odroid
Site Admin
 
Posts: 29067
Joined: Fri Feb 22, 2013 11:14 pm
languages_spoken: English
ODROIDs: ODROID

Re: ODROID-C3

Unread postby mad_ady » Thu Jan 11, 2018 2:51 pm

The new gpu might be problematic in terms of x11/wayland support
User avatar
mad_ady
 
Posts: 4846
Joined: Wed Jul 15, 2015 5:00 pm
Location: Bucharest, Romania
languages_spoken: english
ODROIDs: XU4, C1+, C2, N1

Re: ODROID-C3

Unread postby rooted » Fri Jan 12, 2018 12:05 pm

CNX says 10/100 LAN?
User avatar
rooted
 
Posts: 5838
Joined: Fri Dec 19, 2014 9:12 am
Location: Gulf of Mexico, US
languages_spoken: english

Re: ODROID-C3

Unread postby phaseshifter » Fri Jan 12, 2018 1:37 pm

thus given so farr could we be seeing a new "C series " board by mid year...????

and some might say if usb 3 is on offer you could back that up with a Gb eth port and have a dual eth board
with internet traffic incoming on the 10/100 ..and networking via the Gb port..dunno if that makes any sense though..just a thought
Build It And They Will Come...Be Bold And Mighty Forces Will Come To Your Aid..!!!
phaseshifter
 
Posts: 2988
Joined: Fri May 08, 2015 9:12 am
languages_spoken: english
ODROIDs: N-1..c1+ ..c-2..xu3 lite,xu4...u-3..
u-2...other odroid acc`s as well

Re: ODROID-C3

Unread postby rooted » Fri Jan 12, 2018 3:17 pm

If the SoC only has 10/100 LAN that is a regression, no way would we want that. I'm assuming it was a typo or misinformation.

The 922 seems to be where it's at, maybeImage
User avatar
rooted
 
Posts: 5838
Joined: Fri Dec 19, 2014 9:12 am
Location: Gulf of Mexico, US
languages_spoken: english

Re: ODROID-C3

Unread postby memeka » Fri Jan 12, 2018 3:39 pm

922 seems at least 2 years from market if you ask me
User avatar
memeka
 
Posts: 4063
Joined: Mon May 20, 2013 10:22 am
languages_spoken: english
ODROIDs: XU rev2 + eMMC + UART
U3 + eMMC + IO Shield + UART

Re: ODROID-C3

Unread postby rooted » Fri Jan 12, 2018 4:12 pm

memeka wrote:922 seems at least 2 years from market if you ask me
It's why I said maybe.
User avatar
rooted
 
Posts: 5838
Joined: Fri Dec 19, 2014 9:12 am
Location: Gulf of Mexico, US
languages_spoken: english

Re: ODROID-C3

Unread postby gunrosu » Tue Jan 23, 2018 4:29 am

Looks nice ... :o

Firefly-ROC-RK3328-CC http://en.t-firefly.com/product/rocrk3328cc.html Price with 2GB RAM $ 50

... but sadly not done by hardkernel :roll:
gunrosu
 
Posts: 9
Joined: Sat Jul 23, 2016 4:10 am
languages_spoken: english

Re: ODROID-C3

Unread postby hugolp » Wed Jan 24, 2018 6:09 am

rooted wrote:If the SoC only has 10/100 LAN that is a regression, no way would we want that. I'm assuming it was a typo or misinformation.

The 922 seems to be where it's at, maybeImage


I like Armlogic is pointing out "Ultra low power" as a characteristic of his new SoC. They could certainly use some work in the power efficiency of their previous SoC.
hugolp
 
Posts: 99
Joined: Thu Mar 14, 2013 2:55 pm
languages_spoken: english, catalan, spanish
ODROIDs: U2, C2

Re: ODROID-C3

Unread postby campbell » Wed Jan 24, 2018 8:25 am

hugolp wrote:I like Armlogic is pointing out "Ultra low power" as a characteristic of his new SoC. They could certainly use some work in the power efficiency of their previous SoC.

Yes, but it's still one of the best. Far more efficient at both idle and performance per watt than the XU4 or any of the Rockchip stuff I've tested. If that hasn't been your experience, it might be something simple - see the various threads on this forum about improving the idle power consumption?

Of course I'm excited for power consumption to be improved even further, though.
campbell
 
Posts: 309
Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2015 1:13 pm
languages_spoken: english
ODROIDs: XU3, XU4, C2, C1+, Cloudshell, Smart Power

Re: ODROID-C3

Unread postby hugolp » Thu Jan 25, 2018 3:56 am

campbell wrote:
hugolp wrote:I like Armlogic is pointing out "Ultra low power" as a characteristic of his new SoC. They could certainly use some work in the power efficiency of their previous SoC.

Yes, but it's still one of the best. Far more efficient at both idle and performance per watt than the XU4 or any of the Rockchip stuff I've tested. If that hasn't been your experience, it might be something simple - see the various threads on this forum about improving the idle power consumption?

Of course I'm excited for power consumption to be improved even further, though.


The only other odroid device I have is a U2 with the Exynos 4412 SoC (patiently waiting for the XU4 update). The Exynos 4412 manages to go down to 0.5W on idle, that is something the Armlogic of the C2 has never done for me. Granted the Exynos 4412 was a mobile phone SoC and the top of the line at its time, while the Armlogic is more of a tablet SoC, not really for mobilephone, and, while not horrible, it could use improvements.
hugolp
 
Posts: 99
Joined: Thu Mar 14, 2013 2:55 pm
languages_spoken: english, catalan, spanish
ODROIDs: U2, C2

Re: ODROID-C3

Unread postby campbell » Thu Jan 25, 2018 4:52 am

hugolp wrote:The only other odroid device I have is a U2 with the Exynos 4412 SoC (patiently waiting for the XU4 update). The Exynos 4412 manages to go down to 0.5W on idle, that is something the Armlogic of the C2 has never done for me. Granted the Exynos 4412 was a mobile phone SoC and the top of the line at its time, while the Armlogic is more of a tablet SoC, not really for mobilephone, and, while not horrible, it could use improvements.

I'm used to seeing about 890 mW at idle on the C2 with mainline kernel, USB disabled, the ondemand governor, and the ethernet in 100baseTX mode, with the RAM at the default 912 MHz. If you drop the RAM clock down to 408 MHz then you get it down to 790 mW or so.

Compare to the XU4 (Exynos 5422) which idles at about 1.5 W on a good day with the ondemand governor, or as much as 2.7 W with the (default) performance governor. At maximum power draw, the C2 is going to be in the low 4ish watts, while I've seen as much as 15 watts drawn by the XU4 under load.
campbell
 
Posts: 309
Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2015 1:13 pm
languages_spoken: english
ODROIDs: XU3, XU4, C2, C1+, Cloudshell, Smart Power

Previous

Return to The Ideas

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests